WC63 wrecker conversion 4Sale (Germany)

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12th Air Force
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My garage: Dodge WC51 built 1942. Former 4x4 MV: Dodge WC52, LR 109 ex MOD FFR (fitted for radio) Series IIA and Series III, Series III Stage1 V8 with Ambulance Body (ex. MOD), Series II 88 ex. BGS (German Border Patrol).
Location: Frankfurt am Main, Germany
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WC63 wrecker conversion 4Sale (Germany)

Post by 12th Air Force »

I found by mistake a WC63 Wrecker Converson that I have seen the first time in 1988. It was used by a local petrol station and some weeks ago I talked with Uli (aka Vario) about it and what might have happend to it.
- Today I found it on a market site for 9,500,- Euros - it's still in the same town. Unbelievable! :D

The price is totally out of scope for that old "petrol station whore" - at about this price you get a good turn key WC63 over here. But I hope it will find a good new home.

Pictures can be found here:
http://www.steel-toys.com/Div/WC63a.jpg
http://www.steel-toys.com/Div/WC63b.jpg

By the way: has someone an idea if the crane is military origin or civilian make?

Keep on doing, Joakim
Last edited by 12th Air Force on Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:55 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: WC63 wrecker conversion 4Sale (Germany)

Post by ng19delta »

Poor beastie.
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Re: WC63 wrecker conversion 4Sale (Germany)

Post by Johan WC52 »

Given it was converted in a time when it was just another surplus military vehicle that could be used for civilian needs, I'd say it's nicely done.

Mos likely nobody will pay that amount for that, but then why not?

Restoring it to it's original CURRENT order would make for an original vehicle. With some subtle add-ons, modern LED-lights, stereo, GPS and a thorough restoration, it would look great.

I think.
One WC52, 1944 chassis, 1943 cargo bed, 1943 engine, plenty of repro parts, all restored by an amateur.
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12th Air Force
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My garage: Dodge WC51 built 1942. Former 4x4 MV: Dodge WC52, LR 109 ex MOD FFR (fitted for radio) Series IIA and Series III, Series III Stage1 V8 with Ambulance Body (ex. MOD), Series II 88 ex. BGS (German Border Patrol).
Location: Frankfurt am Main, Germany
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Re: WC63 wrecker conversion 4Sale (Germany)

Post by 12th Air Force »

Johan WC52 wrote:Given it was converted in a time when it was just another surplus military vehicle that could be used for civilian needs, I'd say it's nicely done.

Mos likely nobody will pay that amount for that, but then why not?

Restoring it to it's original CURRENT order would make for an original vehicle. With some subtle add-ons, modern LED-lights, stereo, GPS and a thorough restoration, it would look great.

I think.

Hejsan Johan,

yes - in a way it's a pitty: the vehicle is not too bad from it's condition and could be converted in a olive drab painted military lookalike.
Due to the fact that it had for 20-30 years one owner I would guess it's a early French Army release that found it's way to Germany. The crane is for me a big questionmark - as you say - it's too professional from it's design. Maybe the French Forces added it. I have no idea.

Anyway: if I would have enough space and would win in the Lottery tomorrow - I would be crazy enough to buy it because it's unique and in a way "cool". But it's too expensive and the invest "far from good and evil" as we say here.
You can compare it with the WC64KD that is offered here:
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=9946
Nice, rare - but who has the money to fix it "beyond any return on investment"? :roll:

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Re: WC63 wrecker conversion 4Sale (Germany)

Post by Johan WC52 »

So it may be rebuilt by the french military? Then one could get it into that condition.

I was thinking more in the line of restoring it as it is. A civilian tow-truck. That could be a hit on the classic car meets, at least here in Sweden, if you added 1960's clothing and accessories.

But, who's got the money!?
One WC52, 1944 chassis, 1943 cargo bed, 1943 engine, plenty of repro parts, all restored by an amateur.
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Location: Frankfurt am Main, Germany
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Re: WC63 wrecker conversion 4Sale (Germany)

Post by 12th Air Force »

Johan WC52 wrote:So it may be rebuilt by the french military? Then one could get it into that condition.

I was thinking more in the line of restoring it as it is. A civilian tow-truck. That could be a hit on the classic car meets, at least here in Sweden, if you added 1960's clothing and accessories.

But, who's got the money!?

Hej Johan,

I was crazy enough to call up the owner and to have a look at the WC63. :lol:
The owner is the son-in-law of the Petrol Station owner, so the WC63 is still in the hand of the original owners since more than 40 years. He is a car mechanic and does not know what to do with the Dodge - fix it for himselves or sell it to "good hands". So I invited him to the Forum and hope he will join us and will rebuilt the Dodge.

Technically is the Dodge very interesting: the crane is original military equipment with a own (second!) Braden Winch that is motor driven too! Both winches (front and crane) are operated from the drivers seat. :thumbup:

The truck is running, but the brakes are "dead". Interesting second conversion: the doors are military conversions too (olive drab on the inside)! From the inside the doors look like from a Ambo and have alloy handles and a wind up window, but they are "made to fit" the WC63. In addition the Wrecker has a soft top. - Interesting combination.

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Re: WC63 wrecker conversion 4Sale (Germany)

Post by Johan WC52 »

Interesting.

As I said, I really hope he restore it to either french military service status or to as-new-civilian-conversion, and not WC63.

It would be uniqe.
One WC52, 1944 chassis, 1943 cargo bed, 1943 engine, plenty of repro parts, all restored by an amateur.
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My garage: Dodge WC51 built 1942. Former 4x4 MV: Dodge WC52, LR 109 ex MOD FFR (fitted for radio) Series IIA and Series III, Series III Stage1 V8 with Ambulance Body (ex. MOD), Series II 88 ex. BGS (German Border Patrol).
Location: Frankfurt am Main, Germany
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Re: WC63 wrecker conversion 4Sale (Germany)

Post by 12th Air Force »

Latest update: it's 4sale now with some spares for 2000,- Euros

Contact via: www.auto-gering.de
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Re: WC63 wrecker conversion 4Sale (Germany)

Post by Skyrookie »

wow dropped from 9500 € to 2000€...common Joakim what are you waiting for ! :lol: :lol:
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12th Air Force
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My garage: Dodge WC51 built 1942. Former 4x4 MV: Dodge WC52, LR 109 ex MOD FFR (fitted for radio) Series IIA and Series III, Series III Stage1 V8 with Ambulance Body (ex. MOD), Series II 88 ex. BGS (German Border Patrol).
Location: Frankfurt am Main, Germany
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Re: WC63 wrecker conversion 4Sale (Germany)

Post by 12th Air Force »

Skyrookie wrote:wow dropped from 9500 € to 2000€...common Joakim what are you waiting for ! :lol: :lol:
Only if I would have 2 1/2 lives... :lol:

No, speaking seriously: if someone has a "boring" standard WC63 in good condition and is interested in to turn it into something "special" it might be a cool idea to take down the backbody with the crane and winch. The condition is quite okay (needs only a respray) and it seems that all is US factory made.

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Re: WC63 wrecker conversion 4Sale (Germany)

Post by GoranWC51 »

Hi Joakim,

Tried, in vain, to find the WC63 among 27 pages of Dodge RAM's. But I did find a WC52, of sorts, here:

http://suchen.mobile.de/auto-inserat/do ... res=EXPORT

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Location: Frankfurt am Main, Germany
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Re: WC63 wrecker conversion 4Sale (Germany)

Post by 12th Air Force »

Hej Göran,

I guess it's no longer online at mobile.de.

The other one you found is a Lohner Radio Body conversion from Austria that has been used by the Army in Austria in the 1950ies and 1960ies. - The Lohner body is a very nice conversion - and can be used as a good basis for a comfortable camper.

But the one you found is in a poor condition and the markings are just a silly joke.
It's since a while for sale because the price tag and the sad condition don't match... :roll:
If you are looking for a good Lohner body conversion you should contact a local specialist from Austria as Stefan Legat: http://www.stefan-legat.at/index.php?op ... hicles.php

Keep on doing, Joakim
Last edited by 12th Air Force on Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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My garage: Dodge WC51 built 1942. Former 4x4 MV: Dodge WC52, LR 109 ex MOD FFR (fitted for radio) Series IIA and Series III, Series III Stage1 V8 with Ambulance Body (ex. MOD), Series II 88 ex. BGS (German Border Patrol).
Location: Frankfurt am Main, Germany
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Re: WC63 wrecker conversion 4Sale (Germany)

Post by 12th Air Force »

I added for you two pictures of it to my homepage. See:

http://www.steel-toys.com/Div/WC63a.jpg
http://www.steel-toys.com/Div/WC63b.jpg

The engine is running but the brakes don't work. It needs a lot of sandblasting to get those approx. 127 layers of paint down.
It has US MV doors and a selfmade frame for a hood.
See: http://www.steel-toys.com/Div/WC63e.jpg

The colour is "Aral Blau" - the official colour of the Aral petrol stations here in Germany. It has been in use at this Garage with petrol station since the 1950ies (one owner only since release from the army).

The actual owner would be pleased, if the Dodge could be saved but is not willed to do that XL job. So it's because of this for sale.

Joakim
Last edited by 12th Air Force on Tue Oct 28, 2014 11:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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My garage: Dodge WC51 built 1942. Former 4x4 MV: Dodge WC52, LR 109 ex MOD FFR (fitted for radio) Series IIA and Series III, Series III Stage1 V8 with Ambulance Body (ex. MOD), Series II 88 ex. BGS (German Border Patrol).
Location: Frankfurt am Main, Germany
Contact:

Re: WC63 wrecker conversion 4Sale (Germany)

Post by 12th Air Force »

Skyrookie wrote:wow dropped from 9500 € to 2000€...common Joakim what are you waiting for ! :lol: :lol:
No way - I bought just the WC51. :lol:
But I think you have space and time for a second tiny project - so that both of you have a own Dodge in the future. :mrgreen:
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My garage: Dodge WC51 built 1942. Former 4x4 MV: Dodge WC52, LR 109 ex MOD FFR (fitted for radio) Series IIA and Series III, Series III Stage1 V8 with Ambulance Body (ex. MOD), Series II 88 ex. BGS (German Border Patrol).
Location: Frankfurt am Main, Germany
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Re: WC63 wrecker conversion 4Sale (Germany)

Post by 12th Air Force »

Hello Folks,

sad to say so: I had last weekend a look over the fence and the Dodge WC63 6x6 wrecker is gone... :x

This was just because I was still thinking about to buy it (and to ruin my bank account with such a "barrel without bottom") - or not, if it would have been still for sale - and at an reasonable price (not for 8,000,- Euros something).

At the same time I had a closer look at the rear crane with the braden winch on the photos I took at my last visit. I just wanted to find out if it was a Army conversion or a civilian conversion that has been made lateron.

At first I tried to find a WW2 US-Army vehicle (crane or wrecker) with a similar construction. I spent some hours on research on the www - but no match at all.
Same frustrating result with French Army post war vehicles. :thumbdown:

But then I had the idea to search instead in the "opposite direction" - and that was the turning point: in fact the German Wehrmacht used a very similar crane in WW2! :thumbup:

This crane has been manufactured by the Bilstein Co. - today a well known shock absorber manufacturer and supplier of motorsport parts. It seems that this is a sort of standard crane ("Einheitskran") in the 3 t. class - that has been fitted to many different Wehrmacht vehicles. Especially Büssing, a heavy truck manufacturer with 4x4 and 6x6 know-how seemed to have used it on it's vehicles.

For example the Büssing-NAG Typ 500 S 4x4 truck was in use with the Bilstein crane.
See picture no. 2 from top here: http://www.kfzderwehrmacht.de/Hauptseit ... 500_a.html
That vehicle has been in use with the 15th Panzer Division.

As you can see on this picture is the shape of the winch unit quite different, compared to the Dodge wrecker. - That is because it was possible to turn this Bilstein crane in it's original design.

Having a closer look at the Dodge I found out that the boom and the fittings linked to it have a similar design. The Dodge boom has in addition at the end an indicator for the max. lifting weight, depending on it's position. The indicator is not 100% identical to the one on the Bilstein crane, but fitted in the same position with the same function.
See: http://fahrzeuge-der-wehrmacht.de/Bilde ... r_04-1.jpg
The Dodge part looks like this: http://www.steel-toys.com/Div/WC63c.jpg

More Büssing pictures can be found here: http://fahrzeuge-der-wehrmacht.de/Artik ... _4500.html

So - to sum up my research:

1.Someone had in the end of WW2 - or some years after it - access to a huge amount of US-Army MV parts as a source for the conversion. So the Dodge has the additional rear Braden winch parts as well as the doors from a M37 truck. See: http://www.steel-toys.com/Div/WC63e.jpg
Here is a picture of the M37 with those doors: http://www.motoexotica.com/inventory/li ... -up-green/
The M37 doors can be an indicator for the date of the conversion (maybe early/mid 1950ies because the M37 production started in 1951).

Maybe the rear wings for Dodge are taken from a GMC, Ward La France or some similar truck too?
- And in addition this person(s?) used the remainings of a Bilstein 3 t. crane.
So those fact's could be an indication for a US-Army Motorpool conversion.

2.Because of the design of the US winch parts (driven by power take-off and a fixed prop.-shaft) it was not possible to use the turning function of original crane. So the decision was made to use it in a fixed position on the truck to convert it into a wrecker. Due to that was only the boom and it's rigging used - or should I say "recycled"?

The result was quite professional and the loss of the original mechanical Bilstein parts reduced the overall weight of the construction. = Increased the max. towing weight of the truck. In addition the Dodge conversion is using a diffrent cable pulley system to rise the lifting weight because of it's higher ratio (see theory for beginners at: http://www.ropebook.com/information/pulley-systems ). :lol:
That's the Dodge pulley: http://www.steel-toys.com/Div/WC63d.jpg

As you can see while reading the older posts above it is hard to say who designed that conversion and at what point in the history of this vehicle. But: whoever constructed it did have a detailed knowledge about the construction and did not simply a conversion - he even "pimped" the original design in a clever way.

But even knowing these details does not help, because the vehicle has disappeared now and I don't think that we will see it again. :cry:

Keep 'em Rolling,

Joakim
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